IVRC Meeting – July 2018 – VR and Architecture


Speaker 1:          All right, welcome everybody to the Idaho virtuality council member meeting. So a lot of new faces, a lot of repeat faces, so I really appreciate you guys being here today. We’re talking about something a little bit different from a virtual reality together with architecture and design. So this is something that we at Blackbox Vr and as part of that over to Randy Council, we’ve been preaching for quite a long time. Like vr is great for not just video games, not just for three 60 videos, but you can create inside of it. And here’s all these amazing things that people have done, like Nvidia graphics cards company, they create their entire do headquarters inside vr and so we actually, we’re eating our own dog food and we created the blackbox vr gym inside of Vr. So that’s what we have over here to. Hopefully some of you guys have got to go through it and if you haven’t or get a chance to, uh, learn more about it.

Speaker 1:          And so we’re basically going inside vr and the CSH grade guys will tell you little bit more about this when you’re in that. It’s a whole different sense of scale, a whole different sense of being there and I always use the example of one of my first houses that I decided to build, you know, with an architect. They looked great on paper every, you know, went through it back and forth and saw like pictures on a computer screen and then they put the foundation down and then all of a sudden they put the frame up like that’s such a fun part, right? Because it just seems like it goes up like in one day and then I remember walking in and immediately kind of feeling what it felt like and I didn’t like it and it’s kind of a little bit too late to make changes at that point and ended up finishing the house and I lived there maybe one year before moving because it just spatially, it just didn’t work the way that I thought it would. And that’s what’s great about Vr is because you can go inside that before you actually build things. So I just want to thank CSH grade for having us here. They can give us a great presentation and probably a lot about what I just talked about, think a solar draft and amy for the computers that has helped us to run these vr installations and afterwards if you guys haven’t had a chance to go through that, but we’ll go to the next slide. I think you have to press a button.

Speaker 1:          Kind of talked about that already. So I do want to mention real pass a few upcoming events. We have some coffee talks coming up so that’s the every other week and come and meet people down at a Dutch brothers downtown and just, you know, kind of informally come by and Meet New People. Talk about Vr at, share what you’re doing as well as our next Dev meet up coming up in a couple of weeks, a trail head north and our next member meeting will be focused on art. And then of course the big event this year is our vr bash. So it’s our third annual vr batch. It’s going to be at the REC center on October fifth. So mark your calendars. You’ve got to be there. We’re going to do a totally different this year and make a much bigger party with some of the most crazy vr installations and experiences that you’ve ever and a couple of other surprises, so make sure you put on your calendar to be there. It’s going to be a lot of fun and open to the public, so probably the CSH Qa team today. We’ve got Jim Marsh is going to present to us right over here. So I was rory Hedgie and she’s not here. I heard, but she’s also part of the team. Is She here? Oh, she’s okay. She’s not here. That was Andy’s fault also. She meant to be presenting, but Evelyn was also part of the team that helped us and isn’t a lot of this stuff with vr. So with that I’ll go ahead and hand it over to Jim Marsh.

Speaker 2:          Wait,

Speaker 3:          double microphones is awesome. Where are you going to help me get into some kind of a powerpoint? Hey, thanks for everybody for coming down. We love having people in our office. We’re real proud of it here. Real quick, this was an old warehouse that we’ve remodeled almost four years ago now. I’m street side over here, used to be railroad tracks and so these kind of big windows that you see here used to be the docks where the rail or rail cars would come up and unload stuff. The other side was truck docks and that’s Kinda why we’re sitting up on a little platform here. We moved over here, like I said, four years ago, decided to go full in on the energy efficiency side and we’re actually a leed platinum building here. We’ve got geothermal, we’ve got energy recovery off every one of our computers.

Speaker 3:          That saves us, Gosh, I can’t remember. It’s like three or four tons of cooling, so all kinds of fun features. So we love just having people here real quick. We’ve been here for 129 years, so we’ve been around the block here in Boise. I personally been here for 21 years with csh. Kay. Um, you know, it’s kind of a mouthful of the letters and stuff, but we started here. You can kind of see some of the, some of the, uh, the process of some of the folks that we’ve had over the years currently. The last one, Algonquin Terry with the last one that I did get the pleasure of working with before he retired. So I’m kind of a quick, quick history of us currently, just not very long ago, earlier this month we’ve went from kind of a partnership to a employee owned, so big steps for us are really excited about where that’s going to bring for us. So

Speaker 3:          some of the bigger projects that you might bump into you around here in Boise, some of the older stuff like died in hall, a Taco Bell Arena, more one of our biggest, most prominent one that gets the most travelers course, the Boise airport as well as I know state capital renovation. Um, we do work all across the nation, all states in Canada so we can count ourselves as international, right? Canada counts. Um, so, uh, the real brief history on us, there were architecture, engineering firm here, interior design. So we’ve got internal mechanical, electrical structure. We don’t have any structural. It’s only one, we don’t have it. So what’s next step to that view?

Speaker 3:          Oh, so that is true. So I started, actually, we were working in cad, not hand drawing, but a live in the early eighties. We did get our first computers. We were actually located in the wells west one bank tower now, the big brown one down there next to a in downtown. Had our own computer there, had its own HVAC system, kept it in like 50 degrees, you know, people had to wear a coat when you went inside and uh, it was really, really expensive. So we ran 24 hour cruise on it because we had our first computer. So, uh, you know, fast forward a got into autocad and micro stations where our main programs, autocad was gonna want to go in one way. Microstation was one of our bigger clients, which was albertsons at the time. We did a lot of micro station and eventually I’ll kind of came back to autocad, which is an autodesk product and that’s basically what our main software packages that we do most of our design work are now. So I’m with that. I’ll turn it over maybe here to rory to let him describe some stuff, so we’ll

Speaker 4:          this sheet and I think pretty much what wanting to present to you guys as being in architecture is similar to I think how if you look at a lot of the industries now that are using Vr, how they’ve developed from a flat technology to something that you’re interactive with insurer involved in the environment throughout nowadays. So we start with a hand drawing and then that’s flattened out that even Ryan was saying that you look at on a piece of paper and it looks great and you think it all works, but you don’t really get to see what’s inside the paper or how it looks in perspective or how it feels and then you can do your best attempt with a black and white hand rendering. Which varies. Some people are very talented at. Again, you’re still just guessing on what that would feel like because you’re trying to present an image to somebody hoping that they’re going to enjoy the space but not really understanding how that image is there.

Speaker 4:          And then again, going back to just the tools that we use, do you move from a pencil and paper to a computer that’s helping you draw it so you’re assuming it’s going to help you a little bit more. And then as we continue to go nowadays we all are using bim modeling, which is revvit primarily. There’s other people who can use sketch up, but if you think about it, it’s just a different form of how we build our architecture drawings and how, how we understand the environment and then progressing further. Now we have real time rendering, so as we change walls, as we move doors and windows, we can understand what the impacts are from a spatial awareness of seeing what that looks like. And then finally, virtual reality, which I have a hard time showing on a two d screen.

Speaker 4:          Um, so one of the, probably the first we’ve been using Vr, I’m on a few projects and I think we didn’t really use it to the full capabilities. And so we got to work with the black box team. And I think part of that was just their understanding of what vr can do to have someone actually put the headset on, go into the space and walk through it naturally. Make comments, was a rare understanding from an owner. You can usually have someone look at a picture and feel fine with it, but to have somebody step in there and walk through it and understand what’s going on is pretty unique. And so wanted to bring everybody in, sort of explain that process that we went through with them so that everybody can understand the benefits of being able to use vr in an architecture environment. And so a general process that everybody has with architecture and design, and I think this is for every industry when you’re trying to be in a creative environment, did you have your initial design ideas and then you move through to what that space or what that game in itself is going to turn into in three d.

Speaker 4:          and so we took that project and the initial design ideas modeled it in three d in black and white. So there’s no textures, there’s no color. There is nothing that’s going to influence you but the space and so then you have a black and white spatial awareness where you’re allowed to walk through it and you can see everything in and understand what that feels like and then eventually once those are approved or you move forward with and you think you’ve added all right, yeah, the materials and then by adding materials to space changes in how it feels again because now you have black or white or you have color or you have light and that’s actually going to make the room feel smaller or the room feel larger and their spatial awareness changes.

Speaker 5:          Again,

Speaker 4:          I think one of the best engine or the best design ideas that I came away from this was actually the initial designs we had for space, which is the warm up area, which you can look at all three of these and realize that if once you step over and look at it in that model, it neither one. None of these is what the final product is over there. And so we did a realtime render with sitting in Vr and showed what this. So you could stand in the same spot, which each of these images are and you could scroll through each one and understand what that space felt like as it changed. And this was just black and white and so you came away with ideas or comments of, well this looks great, but I’d rather be there. And then you turn around and you looked at, well what does it feel like when you walk into here? Or does it feel like when you’re leaving? And so the first one was nice, but then there was a comment of, well, what happens if you’re sitting at the vanity when you’re looking at somebody walking, working out, okay, well now what if we move the vanity somewhere else? Well now the space is even smaller. So there’s how do you mix and match each of these to make it feel right? Until you get to that point where you’ve created the design that you wanted it to.

Speaker 4:          And this is a great example of walking through just some of the understandings and design ideas that you can put in a corridor. And then one of the things we always preaches architects and designers is, it’s not always the what you want it to look like, but sometimes it’s better off just to say what you don’t want it to look like. And so some of these images had a quick no and a couple of them at a yes. And one of them have maybe. And so we went through it and the only limit that I think we can push on some of the programming and some of the inputs that we get would actually be to have lighting and the ability to have items move. And so in the future hopefully we can have an application that will be able to show light moving and the change of scenery as it’s almost a movie so that you could understand the full complexity of what’s going on in the space. Because right now we’re still in a stagnant stage from an architecture and design that we haven’t been able to crossover to what gaming is able to do. And so that’s one of the,

Speaker 4:          I guess, handcuffs that we have with the programs that we’re using and we’re trying to evolve into getting into those as well. And this was just another standing image of how the final product comes at the end and this is typically what everybody else see out on the marketing board for what you’ll see in the different areas.

Speaker 4:          Architecture and again, it’s kind of hard to explain what something feels like in Vr when you can’t have them put on a headset. And so as we keep moving forward, I think this is just how the vr environment works. There’s a lot of programs that are being generated now that you can actually build in Vr. And so being able to make spaces while you’re in the headset is probably what’s going to be moving forward. We’re still limited on that capability so we have to do the best we can with a flat screen and then going back and forth into vr and not being able to design in it. The next one is also just trying to educate all of our clients so that they can review it in Vr. We’ve had discussions about it being able to actually walk through whatever space you want to design or whatever it’s going to feel like as a huge advantage from both your decision making because you can see what materials are going to be in there, what the space is going to be because it might feed.

Speaker 4:          You might think that a 10 by 10 box is big enough for what you want to do. Once you get in there and put your arms out, spin in a circle, find your desk, sit down, realize that you’re going to put some drawers in your office and then all of a sudden you’re going to have a bunch of lamps in there. Now your 10 by 10 boxes become really small, but you never understood that until you actually put on the headset and walk through it. So it’s trying to make sure that everybody in their right mind can think in Vr and put the headset on and actually have an understanding of what they’re putting forth. And then some of it’s working, which is kind of the future of how technology is working in the Internet and how people are now trying to set up virtual meetings and so it’s interesting that everybody can be on a phone call today and also be in the headset together and see each other as an Avatar. One of the things that architecture is working on, and there are some programs you can do it, is you can jump in as an Avatar and meet in the project yourself so you could be in one space. The designer could be in another city and all both of you could walk through together and point out things and you could have a full conversation while walking through whatever building you’re designing. Which is a pretty cool and interesting spot.

Speaker 4:          I think we have multiple challenges. I’d say the first one is getting them to put the headset on. Usually we have to walk them through just the space themselves with this screen and then convinced somebody that, hey, you want to put the headset on and understand how it actually feels once they put the headset on. Usually depending on what’s in there, I would say they’re not usually going longer than five minutes at a time unless they’ve done it before and it’s typically. I think the process that we’ve gone through is the initial time that somebody puts on their headset. We walk them through so they’re not trying to use hand. The hand controls are remote. They just stand there and look and we’ll guide them through the spaces that they want to and then stop and then say, Hey, if you want to look around, take your time, do this and that, and then they start to do it and I’d say probably about two or three minutes into that.

Speaker 4:          They’ll either be excited about it and keep going or they’ll be like, oh, okay. I’m pretty good. Like this is enough for me. And then somebody else chimes in and says, Oh, I’ll do it. Or that’s pretty much the end. And then you go back to looking at it on a screen. But again, it’s going back to the same process of educating and once you get used to it, you know, people stay in there and can play. For Awhile, but uh, I mean that’s pretty much what we’ve been working with in Vr and I think the best way to explain how we’ve been designing for the futures actually just walked him through models and understanding how they are. So is there any other questions that we have about how we do this or what your benefits could be real quick? I probably have 50 answers.

Speaker 5:          One hundred percent. What percentage, what percentage is used with management and what percentages you

Speaker 4:          percentage wise? I don’t, uh, I, I’d probably say design wise depends on who’s designing it and then from just from experience doing the black box, I think you do a lot majority of it on the flat screen and then when you feel like you’ve reached a point that it works and you understand it, you put it in the headset. And so I’d probably say 20 percent of the design time would be in vr

Speaker 5:          tickets.

Speaker 4:          Probably 50 percent designer, 25 percent client and 25 percent of time

Speaker 5:          go

Speaker 4:          well. Having the ability to meet in a space, um, when you go through the design process as an architect with engineers and with the client, you’re trying to explain how everything goes together and why this design, this decision was made, why this has put there, why you have a light. Um, so just for discussion purposes, why is option one, why do we have a wood lattice there? Um, it’s a design feature and it’s also acting as a buffer between the vanity area and the workout area. When you have three people in there. I might think that this is a great idea, but I’m not thinking at the same idea that Ryan was at the time and says, well, do you want somebody actually at a vanity if they’re right next to them, someone’s working out or trying to warm up for their gym session. And so we came back to the conclusion that maybe that should move and change.

Speaker 4:          You don’t understand that until both of you are looking at it and in the space at the same time, we also have a large mechanical duct going through that space. So we have to know to move that which is actually don’t have a pointer, I’m pointing my skinny, which nobody can see, but in that and this entity and so until you’re standing there and both of you can have the ability to look up, you know, we, like you said, you can look at pictures all you want, but until you have three people sitting in that space in virtual reality, I think that too, and I think one of the biggest benefits as well as your schedule of how fast you’re moving because your decision making process becomes quicker since you’d feel and understand the space better instead of actually just taking pictures and understanding what a two d plan looks like.

Speaker 5:          Brought it to completion in virtual reality.

Speaker 4:          Um, I think we’re slowly pushing that envelope and trying to do our best at marketing how it is. But again, it’s the getting the knowledge out and they, the benefit is such a strange idea for a lot of people. Like I said, to get the client to just put the headset on for us has been a success. And so a lot of these we undertake is just doing it on our our own and trying to present to them like, hey, you want to do this? And it’s an additional step in the design process up front, but not the benefits as we go. I think people will start to see it and it’s slowly gaining traction, which I think a lot of Vr is until that is a little more mainstream, I think it’ll take clients and every one a little longer to understand go there than they’re in there

Speaker 5:          go in this direction. So a lot of software as well as your physical interface. Those seem like we got, we got the goggles, we have the showing things, but the interface seems to be a problem. Are we developing that developing that is boise because a developer to do that. Looking at the greater rural community, how really adapts to that point?

Speaker 4:          That’s a great question. I would say we are not developing that. One of the

Speaker 5:          I can

Speaker 4:          hardships I guess that we have is that while this is all great from a certain aspect to it, we still have to be able to document it legally from our plans that cities and states have to review and so that puts the limitations on the program that we’re using. There are other programs I think that would allow us, which would also be a separate step. So while we’re going through this, we’re also providing the documentation. You get a permit to build what we’re trying to put together, the interface. If we could do both at the same time with being able to design. I know that’s what Jim wants to do is just put on a headset all day and build things until we get to that point. I don’t know.

Speaker 5:          So

Speaker 3:          the programs that we have over here with the walkthroughs, get our client with a headset on and we could be in the program, changing materials, moving walls, changing colors. So there is a disconnect between the person in the set actually isn’t doing it, but we could be reacting to comments and stuff directly. So I think we’re, you know, we can use it in that regard and that really helps our decision making a lot more. You know, right now our world works just like everybody else where it’s, we email off a plan, you wait for somebody to open the email, they comment on it, they send it back. And so there’s this disconnect is from information training where we can get people together. Then it makes it, it speeds up our process immensely.

Speaker 5:          Undeniably thought leadership. It’s really emerging space. There’s a lot of companies that are doing this stuff. Where are you getting your inspiration from?

Speaker 3:          Trial and error. A lot of it I think just um, we were really lucky. We have Evelyn who’s over in the corner, she’s our bim manager, Doug Lee. We committed, we committed to send Evelyn to what’s called Auto Desk University, which is autodesk’s yearly once a year and they have all of their stuff and she can probably describe that and she comes back with all kinds of great ideas and tries to spin them off. And that’s where we get a lot of this stuff and try to see if it’s feasible financially to try some of this stuff. And I’ll let you kind of.

Speaker 6:          Hi. Yes. Autodesk university is basically a conference that talks about the autodesk software and then various suites, rabbit, autocad. Mainly what we use here and the different tips and tricks and industry peeks into the future. I guess that’s kind of how we figured out, Hey, I think I thought what five or six years ago. And I said, Hey Jim, there’s this really cool thing and we can do now. Let’s try it two or three years back, right? Yeah. True. Three back, our first venture into vr. Would it be the Google cardboard? Of course. And then it evolved to the Samsung Vr gear and now has evolved into this. Now in the construction industry, they are beyond this, they use ar. There is a program called bim three 60 glue, which is a ad in that can use an ipad and you tell a spot in the drawings what pipes are, what ducks go where all they have to do, take the IPAD and move it up and see the thing is not even constructed yet and you can see, so architecturally we are kind of on par for the Boise area, bigger cities in Asia, Australia. There’d be on this. They’re doing the multiperson avatar meetings here. Beyond this we’d say no, it is not common, but we do come, but I have been fortunate to be involved in this within our company and it is a boon for us and yes, I have made people motion sick in Vr

Speaker 5:          in a real space like that that could possibly negative delayed something later on your table.

Speaker 4:          Say it’s actually the opposite is because we see them all now and you actually walked through the space. You see the mistakes that you wouldn’t have actually noticed before on a two d plan that the contractor would look at it and they’d say, oh, hey, the guy’s laying the pipe and now that is interfering with your door, that’s these two chases are lining up and they’re not supposed to because somehow it was Mr. or somebody in the field didn’t do it exactly how it was John. But I mean we have every single duck modeled for where all the air flow comes through for this. And so you can actually, even in this, when you could see there’s um, you know, it’s great to point out your flaws, but there’s electrical outlets. They’re hanging out on the wall and from our standpoint that’s not the greatest thing to have.

Speaker 4:          And we fixed it. But on the plan it might be a foot over. And so then when you walk through it, you’re like, oh, these need to be indicated for where they’re supposed to go. And then. So from a coordination standpoint, I think it’s actually better from a design standpoint too. I think you have decisions that are made quicker. A lot of the time we give a rendering or you present something and you can articulate as much as you want, but until somebody gets in there and says, I want this, no, I’m dead set on this being read. And you’re like, well that’s a bad idea, but okay. And then. But you put it in Vr and they look at it and they go, well fred is not good so you’ve already skipped that week of delay that goes back and forth. So I think you get a better design actually out of it.

Speaker 5:          Um,

Speaker 4:          so

Speaker 4:          I think I haven’t, we have a couple Ar. So generally what we’ve seen is you have the division between Ar and Vr in using it in architecture. A lot of ars generally used on a renovation project because you can see what you’re looking at and then project what is going to be there in the future. And it’s actually somewhat harder for normal for the general public to visualize that because it gets confusing with what’s around you. Whereas putting everything into vr becomes easier to understand for what the final product’s going to be. Off the top of my head, I can’t think of any case studies. I do know there’s four or five programs that are out there that you can do using Ar, so I didn’t answer it.

Speaker 5:          What is the value that the architect, if I want to buy a house and I work with you, you’ll provide me with a to the floor plan that I can basically abstract in my mind, but you provided me also the security that this is doable, that are constructed with this. In other words, you’re very focused on traditional. Now the visualization so far was I, okay, let me throw in some renderings and here’s a photo or if your child is that better, and I’m like, no. So now you have this amazing technology, but you’re the technology you’re using right now. All of your word not set up to feed into this bed. Acknowledge, acknowledges the problem that you know the first time rendering. How do you see or value change over the next five years? It’s been so important right now. I couldn’t imagine spending 99 percent of the time in revenue and working on the model and defend them and whatnot and maybe a little bit of time in for year end running environments where you make this fast food and performance. Do you see that changing? Do you see? Did he change it to the point where you tools that you are changing more towards the rendering part? Where is the. I told him to be so important for the nucleus of change will actually provide.

Speaker 3:          Okay, so you know the challenge is architects is contractually we provide black and white line drawings for construction. That’s what we have. That’s our. That’s how things get built. That’s how the basis of our whole pieces. So what we ended up with is this great tool that helps us as a design. When we first got our first single license of our, our realtime rendering, we we were tracking down that one person that has it open and said, hey, get out. I want to get in. Because they’ve got so popular. Just as a design tool internally certainly helps us with the clients. We’re still a commodity based industry, we’re customer service oriented, we’re bid competitively with all of our competitors, so you know, having a value proposition to convince our clients to pay us more is still going to be a challenge if it a differentiator that we provide this as a service above and beyond what our competitors do.

Speaker 3:          That’s probably where we’re at now. Hopefully we developed the value of this system that helps offset that, but one of the bigger challenges is we’d love to be able to place caught. I mean we have the ability in our software to put cost on all of those items to run quantity takeoffs on all of this, to have the contractor be able to walk through this and provide that to them so they can see exactly where the pain goes and starts and stops because doing it on a d drawing for contractors is not overly intuitive as well. Legally it gets really mushy for us. So are you going to have as many of you know from modeling? Are you going to model every single piece of the building? I mean that would. It would just cripple our, our industry, so if we don’t show the outlet that happens to be in the wood, Zach now going to be a liability for us.

Speaker 3:          So from our standpoint, releasing things to contractors and such as it’s a real kind of a touchy part that we’d love to do, but it’s also putting ourselves out there at, at risk. So I think that’s one of our bigger challenges right now is from our industry. So right now it’s being mainly a designed tool. Yeah. I think it has way more possibilities and with some hefty disclaimer stuff, we do send stuff to contractors and have sit down meetings and say see this is how this all goes together. Or they can call us and we can pull the nice thing with these, you know, poll section cuts all the way through the building it with our renderings and everything on so that they can really see and visualize how this stuff goes together. But contractually it’s going to be a challenge.

Speaker 4:          I guess I’ll add one little snippet to that. I think you can also look at it on two different sides of it is what is our client looking for. There are certain clients who are looking to develop something in a larger scape, a larger landscape that they want these awesome images and the ability to do fly throughs and have people walking from a sales standpoint so that they could have tenants come in and lease it or have a perspective clients come in and see what they’re building and so on that side, I think it would start to see a little bit of a design divided into like the design and marketing aspect to it, which I think if you slowly push that side of it, you would develop more into doing more real time renderings and have more people focused in that realm. But then we still go back to what we do as architects is get things built and put together so

Speaker 3:          well. I think if everybody had one of those, a demon computers at our clients did it. It would. It would help us out a lot. But seriously, I mean a lot of these files and these pieces that we have, um, you know, standard laptop can open them. So we could say out of standalone files we could have provided to our clients, they don’t have an Oculus, they may have a phone. So I think the technology breach between our office and our clients, they all have to come here or to another location that has that, that’s, that’s probably one of our biggest challenges. So if we had our clients that could do it, could actually utilize this more and teach them and educate them on that. Or has it becomes less hardware intensive and software intensive than I think it. I think the other, the other

Speaker 4:          part that we’re dealing with in this gets into a little bit of the nuts and bolts is the materiality. Everybody likes the pretty picture. It’s a lot harder to walk through it and create the pretty picture. So if you jump into a couple of programs that render for us, whereas to take from an architectural model that we’re working with in rabbit or sketchup or arche cat or whatever that process is. And then take it into unity or unreal engine or gaming gaming engine to allow us to render realtime a lot quicker and a lot faster. We lose a lot of our properties and going from whether it’s polygon or nerves base to get that aspect to it, so those are. That’s actually the largest or hardest step that we find is to take what we do and materiality and take it and put it into a better render for a gaming engine that will allow us to facilitate walking through it and have that file be smaller that you can now upload and have other people look at.

Speaker 5:          What was that?

Speaker 3:          That is a grand challenge in itself.

Speaker 5:          Ideas.

Speaker 4:          I think the linkage between creating a, which we sort of have with some of the programs that we use that link from an architecture software into a gaming engine and not having to jump through hoops if I think that’s probably the ultimate task. If you could achieve that and if you develop that software and ran into architects, you’d probably put Boise on the map for one software company for sure.

Speaker 3:          Yeah. And just the. The amount that you have to model, you know, most of this stuff we do get, we do have our engineers in house and model everything in red and they have issues with it. It’s our software still more based for architecture than it is for engineering sloped piping and rabbit and so now instead of what are, you know, a plumbing, mechanical engineer at a schematic lines saying here’s the drain line and they’re just kind of dash lines and you relied on a craftsman in the field to take that basically suggestion of how all this stuff goes together and put it together. Well now we would be putting the drain in the downpipe. The p trap, the connection piece and their modeling. It’s just a lot more work. Not that it doesn’t have its value is it necessarily needed to construct for construction?

Speaker 3:          Probably not and we’ve been doing it the other way for a long time, so being able to automate some of those kinds of things from the engineering standpoint would certainly do it. Having the rest of the industry provide us, they’re what we call them, our families or Jason blocks or small models. It’s the bed there, be a chair or air conditioner or any of those pieces that we can bring in and it has all the right attributes and we can actually utilize it. So you get through a model like we do and you know, two thirds of the manufacturers might have it, but you know, there’s more detail in an air conditioner. Then we’d probably put it into a full building sometimes of everybody that’s going through that kind of stuff. So then we kinda dumb those pieces down and say go see the kind of sheets and those kinds of things. So as the industry opens up and more of those kind of pieces are available, it’s going to greatly simplify some of that kind of stuff too. So, um, I mean ultimately they’d be loved, have just an interactive model in the field for our clients, for our contractors. Everybody’s seen it, they bought off on it. It’s got quantities, costs, and you can just build as you go. They can manipulate the model as they need to define the information that they need to build it, but there’s a lot of hurdles to get through

Speaker 2:          that. Say

Speaker 3:          the silence. We’ll wrap it up.

Speaker 2:          Yeah.

Speaker 1:          Anything else? Alright, well another round of applause for these guys for opening up their place.

Speaker 2:          I appreciate that.

Speaker 1:          No, it’s funny. I’m listening to the questions and and seeing that the perceptions that people have around some of this technology and it reminds me a lot around when the Internet first came out and I always use that story because you know, when I first started my first company back in 1999, I would tell you about the internet, about websites and people were token fused battle. Why would I want to do that? Why would I want to buy anything like this? Is My credit card going to get stolen and don’t have to have one of those aol cds go to http, colon forward. So I don’t even know how to do that. Jeff basos yesterday, Amazon just got named the richest person in modern history of $150,000,000,000 and five percent of all us retail goes through one company and it was shocking the amount of people back then that didn’t really think you need a website.

Speaker 1:          I remember like this front of a magazine, do I need a website? Maybe you don’t fear business. Then it got to be put content on the Internet. Well, why can read a magazine? It hurts my eyes. These crt monitors and I don’t really like reading. It’s not that much stuff out there. Just a bunch of weird stuff. And now look what happened. Content is all, almost every magazine has basically out of business. And then I remember when it was video, he’s, you know, you can watch like moving pictures on the Internet and it was like a new thing, you know, flash files and things like that and this was before youtube and everyone was like, holy cow, that’s amazing. But I got so many channels on cable, like why would they want to sit there and my computer and watch that now look at Netflix now, look at basically all of it is going on the Internet.

Speaker 1:          So virtual reality is right at that point. Like we’re so lucky, like don’t you wish you could go back before Amazon and sit in that little office where they were building their desks themselves. There’s pictures of Jeff Bezos doing that and just trying to sell books on this thing or I don’t. You wish you could go back before content became like a really big thing on the Internet and you can be one of those first people first social networks. You could go create youtube. Like if you could do that, if you could go back in time, anybody would do it and we’d be saying your name instead of all these billionaires out there. That’s where virtual reality is right at this moment. And the value proposition of vr for architecture is immediately obvious. Putting it on paper as an abstraction from what you really want. You’re abstracting the idea of a physical place and putting on paper and a drawing.

Speaker 1:          We just understand it. Then you have the three d drawings and then you go into a computer drawings, right? Which was a big change and you know what I really want. I want to tell them I want this and I want them just to make it appear in front of me. I want to be inside of it. I want to just right now in this room, grab that wall and it follows some kind of rule set, push it three feet that way and then I want to like change the cut a little bit and grab that window and move it over here and I wonder what it’s going to be like in January around 5:00 PM because you guys ever been in a place where that sun is beating down on you and you should have put blinds on there. Something like that. In fact, it’s funny in our office right now, we put a cardboard box to block this skylight.

Speaker 1:          It literally like this cardboard box in there just because it’s like in our face, you can go to January 5:00 PM and see exactly where the sun’s going to be and how it’s gonna Affect that room and I want to move this floor and I want to move that ceiling and I want to be in it for real and then I’m going to say, Yep, I want that and I’ll just write the check and hopefully you can just make it that quickly without ears. That’s what virtual reality gives you the ability to do. And we’re only a couple steps away from youtube being created from Amazon being created from all this different software that’s gonna come out that’s going to make it simple for all of us. And so what I say is build the capability now. So what these guys are doing is they’re on the forefront of it.

Speaker 1:          They’re going to conferences, they’re trying to software and that software is not that great and it’s, it’s weird like when you walk around in it, you know, and so I do vr all day every day and moving around. It’s kind of kind of moves around, kind of weird. It’s kind of buggy. It’s kind of. It’s not perfect the way it looks. You can’t send it to people because they don’t have the headset. They don’t have a computer that can run it, but that’s the same things. They didn’t have the AOL CD, they didn’t have a smartphone. I still have that little flip one and I’m not switching because I liked that I will never switch to an iphone. Obviously everybody goes there. Build a capability now build the understanding, building strength. The world is moving in that direction and you are going to be a leader in the forefront of that here in Idaho or you’ll be looking back and say we missed it and that’s what’s so exciting about what csh is doing, so really appreciate you guys opened up for us and really appreciate everything you guys are done here and hopefully gets.

Speaker 1:          Haven’t had a chance. Go try it out and you won’t get motion sick if you do it just for a few minutes and just speaking to that, that’s the first question. A lot of people ask motion sickness. Usually comes from bad design of the VR program or bad quality of the the headset. So a lot of those, like Samsung Gear Vr is there, they’re just not. They don’t keep up with the frame rate, so you get sick or some of them you kind of move around in it, you know, so the main idea of getting sick and Vr is that there’s motion going on where your body doesn’t feel it, your inner ear. So then the difference between those two things is what makes you feel sick. So you see motion in your eyes, but your inner ear says we’re not moving. Something’s wrong. Your body is basically telling you laid down, like here sick, there’s something going on. You were poisoned or something like that. So if you design it correctly and this program is pretty good at that because you teleport around versus having to just move around, you’re not going to get that motion sickness. And then some people are a little bit more successful than you do get those, but it really comes down to the program design. But yeah, that’s my soapbox and I’m stepping off with. I wish there was three microphones.

Speaker 2:          Alright, thanks.

End of Presentation

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